What is the “endgame” of MGTOW?

So, at least hypothetically, MRA’s want to change society and legislation to help men.  (Whether or not Paul Elam has done one positive thing is not in the scope of what I’m writing, thought I think he hasn’t.)

MGTOW’s seemed to propose an individualistic solution. They would not be going onto marches or trying to change legislation.  They were operating n a new world where information could spread quickly and the old ways of “top down” do as you are told would not work.  They were operating in a society that was growing increasingly atomized.

So this seemed like the “new” answer.  But after several negative interactions, I began doubting the sincerity of these guys.  Are they trying to “help fellow travelers?”  Are they trying to scam cash on books they’ll never publish?  Are they trying to feed their ego with “tough guy talk?”

The question that begs to be asked is what is the “endgame?”  Will this “philosophy” help low status men?

19 thoughts on “What is the “endgame” of MGTOW?

  1. The conventional MGTOWs have no endgame and that is why I have long said that the best way forward is to do things only because you want to do them and they are beneficial to you. In other words, don’t do things because others tell you to or expect you to..

  2. MGTOW itself doesn’t have an endgame, only the individuals in it do. Some are MGTOW+MRA combo, others go fully ghost (I’m in this camp personally), yet others want to build an empire for themselves.

    >Will this “philosophy” help low status men?
    It won’t solve all your problems, but will save you tons of money by taking females out of your pocket. Also, guys like The Mayor of MGTOWn actively help the homeless by donations (giving them food, clothing, work).

    1. Interestingly enough, I haven’t seen many MGTOW’s talking about going ghost since 2011. I don’t see the Youtube guys talk about it. (It was way different in 2011 and far less authoritarian in my opinion.)

      1. I actually prefer blogs to videos (occasionally putting them in the background while doing stuff), but by doing a quick search I realized that Sandman puts out a video about it every year, so it’s about time he recycles the topic again. 😀 But I agree that it doesn’t get enough attention on YouTube (it does on Reddit, though).

    2. The Mayor of MGTOW is a cunt.

      He thinks drug addicts are scum, not deserving of help, but veterans are good guys that do.

      Military vets are people who took government welfare, but want to look their noses down on others.

      1. I’ll have to take your word about veterans, because we don’t have conscription in Hungary anymore (whoever wants to be a soldier has to apply and there are strict physical and mental requirements) and even when we had (during the communist decades) most of it was sitting around and doing nothing (apart from bullying each other).

      2. FYI, in the US (where I believe Mayor MGTOW is based) –it would be older men from the Vietnam era who were subject to the draft, younger veterans from the Mid East conflicts were volunteer.

  3. Are there even many active MGTOW blogs and sites etc. left?

    I mean, there is no shortage of, say, alt-right blogs and there also is a growing “alt-left”, but the MGTOW scene feels pretty dead to me. Dead forums, unprofessional youtube videos with a rather low view count, some very small blogs and otherwise just, well, “failed PUAs”, as you put it here, or simply college-aged boys who currently don’t have a girlfriend.

    On the other hand, I do have the impression that antifeminism actually is something that could easily unite the left and the right; they might disagree on various topics, but it often seems to me that even young men who are super liberal otherwise often hate feminists.

    So it’s strange. On the one hand I think that MGTOW and generally anti-feminist places aren’t really that active anymore, on the other hand it does seem to me that more and more young men are increasingly antifeminist, no matter what they otherwise think about politics.

    1. Anti feminism is a failure, because the right and left share many feminist values.

      If you look at the waffle of a right wing hero like Jordan Peterson, he is basically a feminist.

      1. Jordan Peterson is more likely a “traditionalist.” I found myself laughing when he was whining how difficult it was for high powered women to find husbands. He doesn’t give a shit about the man on the street, that’s for sure.

      2. Peterson is a Jungian, Jung believed that male patriarchal religions suppressed female creativity (we now know, there isn’t any to suppress.)

        Peterson believes in a real rape culture in the middle east. (throwing arab men under the bus. )

        Trad cons are feminists .

      3. What I think is weird is that Peterson is currently held in such high-regards in the “alt-Christian” circles you can encounter on 4chan, 8chan and on ROK, etc. I mean, with his Jungian approach he is to Christianity what Reza Aslan is to Islam.

        With feminism, the general problem is perfectly described in Christina Hoff Sommer’s book, which poses a question: “Who stole feminism?” And the answer to that question is, “Nobody.” Feminism wasn’t a good thing that was “stolen” only after the invention of tumblr and only then TURNED into something bad. But this is the idea I mostly encounter: that feminism was only recently “stolen” and only recently *turned* from something good into something bad…

      4. Hahaha, I know what you mean. I guess if I had the opportunity to get rid off only ONE kind of feminism (only one “subtype”, alas, but still better than nothing) I would get rid off the “liberal” “I’m not a feminist, BUT…”-kind of feminism. The mainstream “equality” kind of feminism.

        Because, let’s face it, the vast majority of women are NOT blue-haired tumblrinas majoring in lesbian dance therapy. The average woman you encounter on a daily basis will not give you a lecture on various branches and waves of feminism but, rather, say something along the lines of “You know, I’m not a feminist, BUT…” And after this “but” there comes a lot of shit.

        And this liberal mainstream feminism is also the most imperialist, heartless, war-mongering kind out there. They are the ones who support imperialist wars allegedly to bring wimminz’s rights to the oppressed wimminz of the east. They are the ones who promote that “conscious capitalism” (=capitalism with female CEOs) crap. That big corporation kind of feminism, i mean, McDonald’s, Burger King, all these big corporations promote that shit on twitter about the “wage gap” and shit like that.

    1. This may seem counter intuitive to most people, but feminism is a symptom of a right wing trad con society.

      in other words feminism exists in a trad con eco system.

      No fault divorce, that is really male fault divorce. Pass by the right.

      Right wingers love jailing low status men, so they pass the violence against women act. Also right wingers want the bad rapist men locked up on a rape accusations not the good men like themselves. lol

      Right wingers love giving women welfare, but want to cut off other men from welfare.

      Right wingers want men to man up and pay child support for children they have no right to see. They will rationalize this by going. “I am not paying for someone else’s kids with my taxes.” These right wingers willingly paid for the family court system that booted men away, so they should pay for the fallout with their taxes. Also women get child support and welfare and free housing anyway, so their point is moot.

      Right wingers want a free market, so weak men die off, and strong men like themselves out compete them and win female approval for themselves.

      When this doesn’t work out for them, they blame communist conspiracies to explain why women either don’t want them, or abuse and take advantage of them.

      1. I only got through the first few minutes of that vid but the ironic thing is when she spoke about R selection/K selection, she was parroting Matt Forney 100%, she even repeated the manosphere mantra that men need “to improve themselves.”

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